Recommend a Delay VST

[crimson]

I'm looking for a free VST delay effect for use with Sibelius 5. The delay don't have to be fancy, all I need is a delay with which I can make a constant delay of 1 sec without any echoes or any other effects. So essentially I want a delay that can, erm, delay they playback of sounds with 1 seconds and nothing else This is to make use of Synful Orchestra's "delay for expression" feature in Sibelius with other VSTis.

I'm also not familiar with the various delay parameters, so I'd be pleased to hear the correct tweaks for achieving this effect. The only delay I have been able to achieve this effect is with Cubase's ModDelay.

I've browsed some effects on kvraudio, but have been unable to find a suitable delay.

[chckn8r]

Hey crimson,

Check out http://www.vstcentral.com/ - go to the plugins page and search on delay - there are a whole bunch o' free ones to play around with.

As for parameters, I guess it really depends on the delay, but in simple terms, all the delay does is capture an input sound and then repeat it back at specified time intervals.

The main parameters you'll have are:

Delay Time - This parameter determines how long the effect will wait before playing back the input signal. The larger the delay time, the longer it is before you hear the "echo", a shorter delay time sort of creates a "thicker" sound by emulating doubling the sound, but that has to be done carefully as you can run into some phasing and comb filtering issues that could degrade the sound.
This is typically in milliseconds, but if it's a more advanced delay, it'll be able to sync to the tempo of your piece and produce a delay time in relation to that (i.e. 1/4 note, 1/8th note etc...). Sounds like you're wanting to do that, so if the delay doesn't have a sync function, there are tools out there to help you calculate delay times in milliseconds - just do a search in Google on "bpm to milliseconds".

Feedback - essentially what percentage of the original signals' volume you want to be fed back into the effect. If you set this to "0", then you'll only get one "echo" of the original signal, but when you start boosting this up, then the delayed signal then gets "re-input" back into the delay and that's how you start getting multiple echos. (Pushing this up to the maximum will just keep adding 100% of the signal on top of itself and you end up with a distorted mess).

Mix (Wet/Dry) - This determines how much of the effect you want to be "mixed in" in relation to the original signal. Sometimes this is just a percentage where 0% is just the original signal, 100% is just the delay and 50% is half and half. Other times, there may be one or two controls to boost or attenuate the wet(delay) and dry(original) signals in relation to each other.

Those are the basics. On delays with more bells and whistles (stereo or multi-channel), you'll be able to tweak things such as EQ, crossfeeding channels, select types of delays such as "ping-pong" or Mid-Right-Left, etc, but when it comes down to it, they all are there to do the same thing - echo back an original signal with some time delay.

Hope that helps.

D

[crimson]

Thanks for the parameter explanations

However, I still haven't been able to find a suitable delay. I've tried five so far, and all of them either repeat the original singnal with one echo, or do nothing, leaving the sound as it is. I've tried all kinds of tweaks. I think feedback is something I don't want to have. I don't want any echos, or then the original sound must be removed so that I'd only get the echo sound at 1.0 sec delay. Also changing the wet/dry rate hasn't helped on those delays I've tried. According to your description it sounds like I'd want to set wet to 100% and dry to 0%, but I tried that too.

Gah, it was so simple with Cubase's ModDelay. With ModDelay, I get the effect I want with the settings: Feedback 0%, Delay Mod 0%, Delay Time 1000ms, Tempo Sync 1x, and Mix 100%

[chckn8r]

Originally Posted by crimson

Gah, it was so simple with Cubase's ModDelay. With ModDelay, I get the effect I want with the settings: Feedback 0%, Delay Mod 0%, Delay Time 1000ms, Tempo Sync 1x, and Mix 100%

You may be dealing with a signal routing problem in Sibelius. You need to have the effect inserted into the signal chain so that the entire signal passes through it. It sounds as though Sibelius is treating the inserting of effects as a Send rather than an insert - breaking off the signal into two - the master mix and a seperate buss for the effect to be mixed in at the master buss.

When the effect is put in the signal chain as an insert, then that's when you'll hear the wet/dry parameters working as you're describing...

D

[gravehill]

The absolutely best free delay vst out there is Kjaerhus Classic Delay. You can grab it at www.kjaerhusaudio.com It's also got a couple of parameters you won't always find in delays. Those are for (optional) tempo syncing and delay filtering (so that the delays have less certain frequency content compared to the original signal).

[crimson]

Great, I'll give the Kjaerhus delay a try as soon as I get a moment I'll also see if I can change Sibelius' effects to inserts.

[VicDiesel]

Originally Posted by crimson

all I need is a delay with which I can make a constant delay of 1 sec without any echoes or any other effects. So essentially I want a delay that can, erm, delay they playback of sounds with 1 seconds and nothing else

Set the feedback to zero, and the dry/wet to 100% wet, so that you only get the delayed signal. Any delay should be able to do this.

Victor.

[chckn8r]

Originally Posted by VicDiesel

Set the feedback to zero, and the dry/wet to 100% wet, so that you only get the delayed signal. Any delay should be able to do this.

Yes, but I think Crimsons' problem was that he was still getting the dry signal mixed in with the delay which lead me to believe that the routing he's got is a bus send to the delay and not an insert.

This can probably be solved in one of two ways:

1. see if you can insert the delay into the track you which to apply it and do the above, or,
2. if that's not available, try muting the original track and if the signal routing in Sibelius is flexible enough, make sure that the send to the delay effect is pre-fader (and mute) so that the track signal gets sent before it hits the track fader. That should give you the delayed signal.

I have to question though - is this for effect or are you trying to compensate for some lag in the system? If the later is the case (which I doubt, 'cause 1 second lag is LONG), then you might want to check out your ASIO drivers for your sound card and adjust the lag compensation in the control panel there.

cheers, D

[VicDiesel]

Originally Posted by chckn8r

I have to question though - is this for effect or are you trying to compensate for some lag in the system?

He's using Synful Orchestra, which is a (rather expensive!) orchestral plugin, that seems to get its realism partly from getting the transitions between notes right -- other libraries typically stink at phrasing -- but for that it needs to analyze the next note together with the current.

Hence some delay in the system. I'm guessing he's having to delay other sounds to match.

Or something like that.

Victor.

[gravehill]

The original post mentioned ModDelay so I take it that Crimson is using some version from Cubase. Cubase does the plug-in delay compensation automatically, provided that it is switched on. Which version are you using?