favorite baroque composer?

[Ron Ofir]

This argument is kind of pointless. You (Rod) clearly Handel a lot, and SeriouslyRetro clearly doesn't. No point in saying that Vivaldi's ouput quality is average.

[Rod Corkin]

Originally Posted by Ron Ofir

This argument is kind of pointless. You (Rod) clearly Handel a lot, and SeriouslyRetro clearly doesn't. No point in saying that Vivaldi's ouput quality is average.

The original post asks for a 'favorite'! by default there will be 'winner's and losers' when asked this question - some will be preferred over others. I suspect I am rocking the boat by placing Handel above Bach and justifying this position, a lot of people will not like that but that is their issue. However I am by no means the first to question the average standard of Vivaldi's works, on the contrary!!

[reith]

It isn't really about winners and losers, just a chance to air one's favourite and maybe discuss him a bit. Qualities are always debatable. I personally prefer Purcell because I know of more Purcell whose dances and short pieces are more reachable, often turning up in quartet playing.

But I'm interested in everyone's views because I'm generally unfamiliar with the Baroque. I've attended the Messiah in the Albert Hall and heard and played a bit of Bach and Telemann and, believe it or not I have never heard Vivaldi's Quattro Fromagii (unless by accident while on hold on the phone). If anything I'm more involved with the Renaissance...but I'm always happy to learn.

I'd have problems with Handel's operas because of the time involved. Baroque operas tend to be long-ish - conventions of the times and probably why Handel came to London. I'm not sure about ranking him in any position with Bach, they were different composers. I've heard some extraordinarily powerful organ music from Bach (played on Silbermanns and a few more renegade romantic instruments) but one can't know if these are how Bach himself would have registered them. The Passicaglia and Fugue in C minor comes to mind.

[Rod Corkin]

Originally Posted by reith

It isn't really about winners and losers, just a chance to air one's favourite and maybe discuss him a bit. Qualities are always debatable. I personally prefer Purcell because I know of more Purcell whose dances and short pieces are more reachable, often turning up in quartet playing.

But I'm interested in everyone's views because I'm generally unfamiliar with the Baroque. I've attended the Messiah in the Albert Hall and heard and played a bit of Bach and Telemann and, believe it or not I have never heard Vivaldi's Quattro Fromagii (unless by accident while on hold on the phone). If anything I'm more involved with the Renaissance...but I'm always happy to learn.

I'd have problems with Handel's operas because of the time involved. Baroque operas tend to be long-ish - conventions of the times and probably why Handel came to London. I'm not sure about ranking him in any position with Bach, they were different composers. I've heard some extraordinarily powerful organ music from Bach (played on Silbermanns and a few more renegade romantic instruments) but one can't know if these are how Bach himself would have registered them. The Passicaglia and Fugue in C minor comes to mind.

Fair enough, and you are welcome to my opinion and have read it, but you will recall I placed the words winners & losers in commas, there was a reason for this. But individuals will always have a preference for some over others, as did the great composers themselves. Personally my favourites are Beethoven and Handel, the others have much less effect on me.

There was a time I would never have thought of listening to a Handel opera, yet now I have recordings of about 25 of them. Time is an issue I confess, these were originally composed for persons who obviously had time on their hands for the occasion, whereas I would have to take a day off work to see one live now. But I was converted purely on the consistant quality of the music, even if I have to listen on my audio player to Act1 on my way to work, Act2 on the way back, and Act3 the following morning!

Concerning Bach and the organ I recall on TV an interesting show that demonstrated a very large instrument I believe Bach had played - firstly using the wind provided by the installed electronic system, secondly using the original fully functional manual pump. I must say the quality of the notes was far more variable using the old system, I'm not sure audiences would tolerate this for very long now. But Handel had nothing remotely like this at his disposal in England.

But the solo organ is not my favourite music, so this is not of the greatest interest to me to be honest. I'm fussy about my keyboards, I only take Beethoven seriously if performed on the fortepiano for example. Steinway would be out of business tomorrow if everybody thought like me.

[SeriouslyRetro]

Originally Posted by Rod Corkin

Most perplexing Mr Retro, I have Beethoven's complete works on CD and my Handel collection is by the clock at least 4 times longer so far without duplications, and is by no means complete. Believe me Handel's output is truly vast, see this link below:

http://www.gfhandel.org/genre.htm

I would like your assessment of this list! And I would say Handel produced many many more 'large works' than Bach. By the clock I would not be surprised if Handel's output way surpassed Bach's. But volume of output isn't everything, far from it. I was most surprised to see Vivaldi him as your number two, considering the rather average quality of most of his output, but never mind. Corelli and Telemann I would say are also very much 'second division' regardless of the volume produced.

Thanks for the link. There are quite a few pieces there that I haven't seen in other lists. I have nearly all Handel's Concerti Grossi, but there are a bunch of orchestral pieces I'd like to check out and maybe the incidental music. Unfortunately, rest of that monster list is mostly vocal or sonatas.

I'd hardly say Vivaldi is average quality. His Opus 3 L'Estro Armonico and cello concertos are great. The slow movements especially have powerful emotion in them. He is currently #2 in my list because the number and quality of the pieces I have is better than the number and quality of Handel pieces I have. If I hear enough new amazing Handel pieces, my order will change. I have less Bach pieces, but they are of such quality and complexity that he remains #1.

Classical radio stations only seem to play Vivaldi's worst pieces. Recently I heard a concerto on the radio and I thought, "that sounds like a second-rate hack doing a pathetic Vivaldi imitation" and then the piece finished and the announcer said it was Vivaldi. Maybe that's causing a whole new generation to mistakenly believe that Vivaldi sucks. ;-)

PS my Amiga 1200 is to date the best computer I have ever used or owned, what a shame what happened with the Amiga...

I always thought Amiga was a great computer, but in 2002 when I read that someone said it was "the best computer ever", I thought they were being unrealistic. Now, after using an Amiga 500 as my only computer for the last 5 years, I can say without doubt that Amiga was the best computer ever made.

[SeriouslyRetro]

After listening to hundreds of new (new to me) baroque pieces, I've discovered that I really have no favourite baroque composer and my previous list was pretty meaningless. I have some favourite pieces by certain composers, but I can't really say I have a favourite composer any more. It would be silly to judge that favourite pieces by one composer are any better or worse than other favourite pieces by different composers. I thought I could judge based on quantity of favourite pieces, but that's silly too.

I guess the question "who is your favourite baroque composer?" is about as meaningful as something like "what is your favourite film?". There's no point in picking one if there are others just as good.