The Horn Page

[Gopher]

In the Instruments page, there is only a single horn there, listed simply as "Horn"; I'm not quibbling at the information inside, it's just that it should be French Horn, so as to distinguish it from the English horn.

[Thorolf]

In the symphony orchestra literature, horn is indeed french horn, and wikipedia indeed lists it as just “horn”, and in different languages, the english version is listed as “(french) horn”. This is mirrored in the international nomenclature for orchestral parts: Just “Corno” for french horn, and “Corno Inglese” for english horn…

If, however, you approach a brass band guy, he will insist that the horn is either in Eb or Bb, distinguished as Alto and Tenor Horn. He will also allow for a Baritone Horn, in the same tuning as a Tenor Horn, but with a wider bore. The soprano of the family is the Cornet, and the Bass is the regular Bass Tuba in Eb or Bb.

Some even distinguishes between three versions in the tenor register, all depending on the bore: Tenor Horn in Bb (narrow bore), Baritone Horn in Bb (medium bore), and Euphonium in Bb (wide bore), with their counterparts in the soprano register: Trumpet in Bb, Cornet in Bb, and Flugelhorn in Bb.

But if you write just “Horn” anywhere but in a brass band score, all agree that one refers to the (french) horn in F. (Which is not actually in F, the first main horn on a double or triple horn, as well as single horns are all tuned in Bb… . The reason it is notated in F, is that due to the narrow bore, it typically has its natural melodic register roughly a fifth above the corresponding registers in other brass intruments! And to make it even more complicated, it is the additional horns on a double or triple horn that is tuned in F, respectively a fouth below for double horn, and still another horn a fifth above the main horn, also in F!)

That’s right, an orchestral triple horn has no less than 3 full sets of tubes and valves…

But it’s still only horn…





Regards

[Bassoonery]

Ahh the lovely English Horn. Why oh why does it have that name? And why does everyone else call it that and we English call it the "Cor Anglais"? One of life's mysteries I guess but I think Cor Anglais sounds much nicer...

[MaestroX]

I remember reading that the French Horn is actually not french, nor is the English horn, English in origin. So where do they come from?

[Will Kirk]

Originally Posted by MaestroX

I remember reading that the French Horn is actually not french, nor is the English horn, English in origin. So where do they come from?

It's the same story with Chinese Fortune cookies, they're American :tongue:

[Student]

The Horn is actually a German variant of the hunting horn. There was also a French variant but it is used less often today, the version that the United States and England uses is the German version of the horn despite the name. It is also called the F Horn (as F is the proper transposition). Calling the horn a "French Horn" is now considered incorrect, and while many teachers still do it you're likely to get chewed out if you make that mistake to a professional player or teacher because then you are referring to an actual French horn, which is different than the German horn which is used in bands and orchestras today. It's a very confusing subject, the horn.

The English horn on the other hand is not a horn, nor is it English. As far as I can tell the reason it is called "English" is because someone made an assumption that it's french name cor anglais meant "horn english." Actually, it "horn angled" and has nothing to do with the English. I can't even guess why it's called a horn.

[kenm]

British brass band nomenclature is different from American.

American ------ British
Alto Horn ------ Tenor Horn (in Eb)
Tenor Horn ---- Baritone [Horn usually omitted] (in Bb)
Baritone Horn -- not known but would probably be called Euphonium
Euphonium ----- Euphonium (in Bb) [= Tenor Tuba in the orchestra]

I was conducting a brass band at the beginning of the year, and asked for all the saxhorns to play. One of the Eb horn players said, "We're not saxhorns, we're tenor horns." Of course, they are saxhorns, and so are the baritones. The original family, as invented by Adolphe Saxe, went from soprano to bass.

[Bassoonery]

^ erm forgive my ignorance but is a saxhorn the same as a saxophone, invented by Adolphe Saxe?

^^ maybe the "angled horn" could refer to the angled crook of a cor anglais - could a crook be called a horn? maybe? I'm surprised the orchestral "French horn" isn't meant to be called French - I've never heard it called any other way, except just horn. True though, they are strange things with a history to match!

[Boneman]

Originally Posted by kenm

I was conducting a brass band at the beginning of the year, and asked for all the saxhorns to play. One of the Eb horn players said, "We're not saxhorns, we're tenor horns." Of course, they are saxhorns, and so are the baritones. The original family, as invented by Adolphe Saxe, went from soprano to bass.

I bet they were not happy at being called saxhorns!

[kenm]

Originally Posted by Bassoonery

[...] is a saxhorn the same as a saxophone, invented by Adolphe Saxe?

Same designer, different instrument. The saxhorn (first made 1843) is a brass instrument, intermediate in shape (i.e. distribution of cross-sectional area along its bore) between the cornet and the tuba. The saxophone was inspired by the ophicleide, a large key bugle. It had a conical bore, keys covering large holes and a brass type mouthpiece. In 1845, Sax replaced the mouthpiece with one taking a single reed, like the clarinet, and the saxophone was born.