Lessons on Composition Techniques - Music-Web Forums

Stenir · #1 07-12-2006, 04:49 PM

I like the idea of the basic notation lessons. It's a good started and refresher course at the same time. However, does anybody feel willing to help create a composition lesson plan? I compose based on what I hear, and that is relative to keys instead of actual notes (I hear music, but see chord progressions using the roman numerals).

I would like to see a composition lesson format. I could try to write one, but I would need help coming up with the lesson topics and lesson order. I can research the information, but what I am trying to study is just so over my head (but then again, I am attempting to understand Arnold Schoenberg's Fundamentals of Music Composition).

I'm only now attempting to understand retrograde and inversion and such things. Something like that would help many people, probably.

reith · #2 08-12-2006, 12:21 AM

I'm not about to rain on your parade here!! I think it'll be interesting to see how it panned out.

I don't believe that anyone can actually teach someone to compose music (or create in similar fields of Art) - the best you can hope is to be a good guide to help the student develop skill with various tools and a good aural imagination. The composer has to have that spark of creativity.

I also happen to agree with Maestrox in that student composers should be encouraged to explore a range of styles; and that a good basis in theory coulpled with practical skills like improvisation is imperative if the "teacher" is to give good value for money.

Personal belief is that it needs a one-to-one approach to really get to what a composer wants to do and what he needs to do to get there. A smallish class would be fine but I'm not sure what you'd teach on the internet. Having said that, it's perfectly possible for students to read stuff here (say) then submit exercises for comment. Bear in mind that UK and US terminology differ extensively, particularly with expressing chords...things that can be circumvented if each know the other's location. So maybe a lot is possible.

All the best, though, and if I can help at any time, just prompt!
Cheers,
Reith

MaestroX · #3 08-12-2006, 02:38 PM

Well Music-Web's online courses (harmony and counterpoint courses soon to follow) offer a good basis from beginner to advanced level. Perhaps you would like to get involved in the creation of these? or suggest a topic that hasn't been covered. As far as teaching composition goes, its difficult and as Reith points out, the best you can hope is to be a good guide to help the student develop skills.

Thorolf · #4 08-12-2006, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by reith

I don't believe that anyone can actually teach someone to compose music (or create in similar fields of Art) - the best you can hope is to be a good guide to help the student develop skill with various tools and a good aural imagination.

Hehe, this remark inspried me to make this thread: The n00b’s guide! How to compose!

Regards

Stenir · #5 08-12-2006, 03:00 PM

It's not so much that I want to "teach" or be "taught" how to compose. It's just a matter of knowing certain techniques.

A semi-decent analogy would be trying to describe what a painting looks like without knowing any other words than "nice" or "pretty".

I certainly don't want to get something going like "You will compose a piece starting with a harmonic progression and you will do it this way...blah blah blah..."

It's more, here's the generalized view of something, say, Counterpoint, since it was mentioned earlier. I don't want to go "You must follow this Species correctly otherwise your music isn't really music."

I think I'm just looking for a guideline as well as some better ideas for words to describe the brilliant art that is the music in my head. Everything's a guideline.

After all, nobody goes exactly 45 miles per hour in a 45 mile per hour zone.

Thorolf · #6 08-12-2006, 03:37 PM

My guidelines are often indirect ones: Other works of art. If it’s good, what’s good about it? If something could have been done better, what would I have done?

Myself seldom apply composition “techniques” directly, it’s only there as a background most of the time. Inversion is often a good way to know a theme better, and while a mathematical inversion might be useless, it may hint at new general ideas that may be useful. I never got much out of retrograding music, tho.

As I have said elsewhere, I always write with my ears, and wrote my first sonata form thingy, before I knew what sonata form was… (the main and side themes were playing simultaneously in the recap, tho, so it was a variant form, to be true, but nevertheless sonata).

But others obviously has more luck than me with employing techniques, so by all means, go for whatever you think is constructive!

Regards

Stenir · #7 08-12-2006, 04:31 PM

Maybe we'll just have to write "The NooB's guide to Compositional Thought and Other Things That Leeroy Never Understood."

Or just "The Newbie's Guide to Composition".

reith · #8 08-12-2006, 07:31 PM

I might try to put together some guidelines for approaching orchestration though they'd be very general, mainly concerned with the development of an aural imagination. Once again, it's very individual though (hoping this doesn't sound too loose) it's possible to guide a student toward "normal sounding" orchestration. Freaky orchestration needs no tuition!

It took me some time to "hear" things orchestrally then write them essentially in that form and I still have to check and re-hear things, so new composers may have to be persuaded not to expect results overnight, if that's the way they want to go. However, I might have got it wrong all the time.

PS. Maestrox' lessons are excellent and here's acknowledging his commitment/effort with thanks. A very good start for students wanting to learn and apply the mechanics behind music.

PPS...just having a problem - there's some code that doesn't decode. Tables? Lessons 7 & 8. Is it something I can put right in the User CP?

MaestroX · #9 09-12-2006, 11:22 AM

Originally Posted by reith

PS. Maestrox' lessons are excellent and here's acknowledging his commitment/effort with thanks. A very good start for students wanting to learn and apply the mechanics behind music.

PPS...just having a problem - there's some code that doesn't decode. Tables? Lessons 7 & 8. Is it something I can put right in the User CP?

Thanks for the compliments

The problem with the HTML code was my mistake, it should be fixed now. Thanks for pointing it out.

Stenir · #10 09-12-2006, 04:40 PM

If we can't do a sraight-up composition thread, perhaps we could do sort of a journal of a composition. We could go into detail about the thought process of the composition as the piece takes shape. Something similar to that. So intead of "here's how to compose", it's "here's how I composed". That also goes along with the thought that the best way to compose is to review scores of others, but this goes one step further by hearing the thoughts of the composer as the composition takes shape as opposed to trying to figure out what the composer was thinking and working off that.